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	<title>Comments on: AOL Has An Odd Password System</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/</link>
	<description>Ethical Hacking, Penetration Testing &#38; Computer Security</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 19:30:03 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: ChaosVein</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59983</link>
		<dc:creator>ChaosVein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:34:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59983</guid>
		<description>That depends what you call serious. The LM Hash is less secure because of the speed you can attack it. You split the password into two 7 character segments and then crack them. At a couple hundred thousand tries a minute even on slow machines you are in pretty good shape within a few hours for insanely random sequences. Even faster if you have access to a rainbow table.

This AOL issue, I can understand how it would have been over looked. Back when I would have read online about someone I heard of who could have potentially definitely wasn't me cracking AOL passwords broadband was not nearly as wide spread which meant you have to dial up and then you got 3 tries, disconnected and repeated until you got a working combo. Now with the AOL over TCP/IP you get three tries every couple seconds. 

There are generally two flavors of crackers out there.

1. Mass attack: You can generate a list of user names from a chat room scan, then using obvious combinations you try a few different sequences for each user. User name, user name backwards, common words, common numbers and what not. Say 20 - 30 generic attempts then move on. It is really surprising what a night of cracking in this manner can return as far as cracked accounts go.

2. Targeted attack: This can either take a single user, or a list. It scans their profile and generates a list of every potential combination using the information is discovered. I would say on average this generated about twice as many working phish as a shorter mass crack but it took quite a bit longer... from what I read online.

So, it really depends on what quantifies serious. 

In retrospect though LM was upgraded YEARS ago and the flaw no longer exists in current operating systems for the most part. (unless they have support for legacy operating systems enabled, which most windows based systems do by default)

Moral of the story: Don't use simple passwords and don't use any generic phrases. Random alphanumerics, thats the best (unless you can use full sentence pass phrases which in this case would be counter productive do to the truncation)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That depends what you call serious. The LM Hash is less secure because of the speed you can attack it. You split the password into two 7 character segments and then crack them. At a couple hundred thousand tries a minute even on slow machines you are in pretty good shape within a few hours for insanely random sequences. Even faster if you have access to a rainbow table.</p>
<p>This AOL issue, I can understand how it would have been over looked. Back when I would have read online about someone I heard of who could have potentially definitely wasn&#8217;t me cracking AOL passwords broadband was not nearly as wide spread which meant you have to dial up and then you got 3 tries, disconnected and repeated until you got a working combo. Now with the AOL over TCP/IP you get three tries every couple seconds. </p>
<p>There are generally two flavors of crackers out there.</p>
<p>1. Mass attack: You can generate a list of user names from a chat room scan, then using obvious combinations you try a few different sequences for each user. User name, user name backwards, common words, common numbers and what not. Say 20 - 30 generic attempts then move on. It is really surprising what a night of cracking in this manner can return as far as cracked accounts go.</p>
<p>2. Targeted attack: This can either take a single user, or a list. It scans their profile and generates a list of every potential combination using the information is discovered. I would say on average this generated about twice as many working phish as a shorter mass crack but it took quite a bit longer&#8230; from what I read online.</p>
<p>So, it really depends on what quantifies serious. </p>
<p>In retrospect though LM was upgraded YEARS ago and the flaw no longer exists in current operating systems for the most part. (unless they have support for legacy operating systems enabled, which most windows based systems do by default)</p>
<p>Moral of the story: Don&#8217;t use simple passwords and don&#8217;t use any generic phrases. Random alphanumerics, thats the best (unless you can use full sentence pass phrases which in this case would be counter productive do to the truncation)</p>
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		<title>By: backbone</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59960</link>
		<dc:creator>backbone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:21:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59960</guid>
		<description>yes mburns it has, but not as serious as this...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yes mburns it has, but not as serious as this&#8230;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Sick of those 100% virus-free claims? Read on &#8212; Security Bytes</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59827</link>
		<dc:creator>Sick of those 100% virus-free claims? Read on &#8212; Security Bytes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jun 2007 09:16:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59827</guid>
		<description>[...] Darknet blog has an interesting item this week on what it calls AOL&#8217;s &#8220;odd&#8221; password problem. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Darknet blog has an interesting item this week on what it calls AOL&#8217;s &#8220;odd&#8221; password problem. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: mburns</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59802</link>
		<dc:creator>mburns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:45:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59802</guid>
		<description>Doesn't the old LanManager hashing system (found in older Windows systems, and OS X via legacy support, IIRC) have &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LM_hash#Security_weaknesses" rel="nofollow"&gt;similar problems&lt;/a&gt;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doesn&#8217;t the old LanManager hashing system (found in older Windows systems, and OS X via legacy support, IIRC) have <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LM_hash#Security_weaknesses" rel="nofollow">similar problems</a>?</p>
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		<title>By: Torvaun</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59798</link>
		<dc:creator>Torvaun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 16:09:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59798</guid>
		<description>I now feel much better about my password choosing procedures.  Any given segment of any of my passwords is as secure as the whole thing, minus some for length.  Of course, when you're dealing with an alphanumeric key with a length of 8, there's only 218 trillion possible keys.  That's what, a few hours on a decent system?  I now feel much better about not having an account at AOL.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I now feel much better about my password choosing procedures.  Any given segment of any of my passwords is as secure as the whole thing, minus some for length.  Of course, when you&#8217;re dealing with an alphanumeric key with a length of 8, there&#8217;s only 218 trillion possible keys.  That&#8217;s what, a few hours on a decent system?  I now feel much better about not having an account at AOL.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ChaosVein</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59797</link>
		<dc:creator>ChaosVein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 15:56:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59797</guid>
		<description>AOL has been like this since the 2.5 or 3.0 days when they expanded how much you could type in for the password field. If you actually use AOL and try to log in fromt he main screen with a wrong password you will get another pop-up window saying your password is wrong and you need to re-enter it. This window has a hard set character limit of 8 characters, a confirmation from within the application itself as to what they actually check for your password.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>AOL has been like this since the 2.5 or 3.0 days when they expanded how much you could type in for the password field. If you actually use AOL and try to log in fromt he main screen with a wrong password you will get another pop-up window saying your password is wrong and you need to re-enter it. This window has a hard set character limit of 8 characters, a confirmation from within the application itself as to what they actually check for your password.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: madmax</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59788</link>
		<dc:creator>madmax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 15:14:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59788</guid>
		<description>Hahahahahahah!!!

This is a big blooper on AOL's part...

Its a pretty common thing people do..passwords withtheir names( or their girlfriends /wives names) which are generally 6-8 alphabets and then try to think of gibberish alphanumeric characters ,@, $,#</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hahahahahahah!!!</p>
<p>This is a big blooper on AOL&#8217;s part&#8230;</p>
<p>Its a pretty common thing people do..passwords withtheir names( or their girlfriends /wives names) which are generally 6-8 alphabets and then try to think of gibberish alphanumeric characters ,@, $,#</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59779</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 09:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59779</guid>
		<description>and the difficulty of bruteforce with 8 characters (while still hard) is so much easier than 12 it isnt even funny</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and the difficulty of bruteforce with 8 characters (while still hard) is so much easier than 12 it isnt even funny</p>
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		<title>By: Lee B</title>
		<link>http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59772</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 07:57:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.darknet.org.uk/2007/06/aol-has-an-odd-password-system/#comment-59772</guid>
		<description>Sounds like it uses an old version of Solaris somewhere (8 maybe?).  I swear it used to do that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sounds like it uses an old version of Solaris somewhere (8 maybe?).  I swear it used to do that.</p>
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